198 – Heal your hormones to bring more pleasure into your love life [Podcast with Dr. Jolene Brighten]

We’re so excited to have Dr. Jolene Brighten back on the PCOS Diva Podcast to discuss how to balance your hormones to improve your PCOS symptoms and your sex life. Dr. Brighten is a board certified naturopathic endocrinologist, clinical sexologist, and prominent leader in women’s medicine. Dr. Brighten empowers women worldwide to take control of their health and their hormones.

Many women with PCOS have a low sex drive, irregular periods, mood swings, anxiety and more. The good news is, there are things you can do to improve your hormones to eliminate these issues. On this episode of the PCOS Diva Podcast Dr. Vinu Jyothi and Dr. Jolene Brighten discuss lifestyle changes, supplements and medication options that may help improve your hormones.

 

Resources mentioned:

Dr. Jolene Brighten’s New Book: Is This Normal 

Connect with Dr. Jolene Brighten:

Dr. Jolene Brighten’s Website
Instagram
Facebook

Previous Podcasts with Dr. Jolene Brighten:

PCOS Diva Podcast Episode 87: STRAIGHT TALK ABOUT PCOS, THE PILL, AND POST PILL SYNDROME 
PCOS Diva Podcast Episode 105: HOW TO MINIMIZE YOUR RISK ON THE BIRTH CONTROL PILL 

 

Dr. Jolene Brighten is a board certified naturopathic endocrinologist, clinical sexologist, and prominent leader in women’s medicine. A fierce patient advocate and completely dedicated to uncovering the root cause of hormonal imbalances, Dr. Brighten empowers women worldwide to take control of their health and their hormones. She is an international speaker, clinical educator, medical advisor within the tech community, and considered a leading authority on women’s health. Dr. Brighten is also part of the MindBodyGreen Collective and a faculty member for the American Academy of Anti Aging Medicine. Her work has been featured in the New York Post, Forbes, Cosmopolitan, Huffington Post, Bustle, The Guardian, and ABC News.

 

 

 

 

Follow Along with the Transcript

 

 

 

Dr. Vinu
Hello, everyone. Welcome to the PCOS Diva podcast. I am Dr. Vinu Jyoti, a preventive medicine specialist and a member of the PCOS diva team. And my passion is to empower women not only to manage their PCOS symptoms holistically, but also to help them rediscover their true self. For more details, please visit PCOS diva.com My podcast guest today is Dr. Jolene Brighten. As some of you must already know, Dr. Brighten has been with us on previous podcast interviews, and I will link those interviews down below. And for those that are new, I would like to introduce Dr. Brighten. She is a hormone expert, a nutrition scientist and a thought leader in women’s medicine. She is board certified in naturopathic endocrinology and trained in clinical sexology. Dr. Brighten is the author of is this normal, a non judgmental Guide to Creating hormone balance, eliminating unwanted symptoms and building the sexual desire you crave a fierce patient advocate and completely dedicated to uncovering the root cause of hormonal imbalances. Dr. Brighton empowers women worldwide to take control of their health and their hormones through her website and social media channels. I’m really excited to welcome Dr. Brighten to our podcast today.

Dr. Brighten
Thank you so much for having me. It’s so exciting to be back. And I get to talk to you this time. So it’s gonna be a very, I think engaging and insightful conversation we’re about to have.

Dr. Vinu
Absolutely, I believe the same Dr. Brighton. So tell us about your new book, is this normal? And how our listeners could you know use this book? What way can they find it useful?

Dr. Brighten
I think that sexual health is one of the most overlooked issues that come with PCOS. So with PCOS, if you find the right doctor, they might start to talk to you about the cardiometabolic implications of it. But a lot of the times, you’re just told you have irregular periods, you might have a hard time getting pregnant. And here’s the pill and we’ll send you on your way. And there’s not a lot of conversation about all of the nuances. As you know, as your audience knows that comes with PCOS. If you’re someone living with PCOS, I’m not saying anything you don’t know because you live in this body. And you know exactly what I’m talking about when it comes to the other issues that you can face. So in Is this normal, the book is divided up into three sections. And the first section is your sexual self. Next comes your cyclical self, which everybody gets to, you know, talks about with PCOS, like where is the cycle and what’s going on with the cycle. And then we get into the 20 day program. Now that sexual self, that’s a piece of PCOS that research exists on but nobody really talks about it. So for example, in the book, I bring up that the research shows and anovulatory cycles, that is when you do not ovulate regularly or you’re not ovulating at all, is associated with what gets term sexual dysfunction, you have to ask, is it really dysfunction? Or is it adaptation I like to think of as adaptation. But when we’re not ovulating regularly, we see that our sexual health is impacted. So that’s not just like, what happens with the tissues, but it’s also what happens in our mind as well.

Dr. Vinu
Right? Yes, and I completely agree with that. So So my next question was, you know, you talk about hormone imbalance, right. And PCOS in itself is a hormone imbalance disorder. So how do do all women with PCOS have hormone imbalance? Or, you know, how is that different from someone who does not have PCOS? versus someone who does?

Dr. Brighten
You cannot escape the hormone woes of PCOS. I would love to be like, No, some people are okay. People who do present okay or are feeling like maybe I don’t have PCOS anymore. They’re employing like a lot of the things I talked about in the book, nutrition, lifestyle and supplementation really that Trifecta to help them manage their symptoms with PCOS. As we know the majority of those with it have insulin dysregulation. In the book, I talk about how insulin and adrenal health are really the foundation of our overall health. And I use a pyramid example. So that’s the base of our pyramid. Above that is the thyroid and at the very tippy top are the ovarian hormones in P with PCOS is that foundation is shaky, which it often is by the time you get the diagnosis, there’s already elevations in insulin. There’s definitely a pool in the adrenals. I talk about that in the book and what you can do for adrenal health. But you can also start to see issues with the thyroid and issues with the sex hormones as well. And as we understand PCOS, and I have to say I like want to do like air quotes. The bunnies in the air have we understand, because we don’t have research to really understand the root cause of PCOS. But one thing we do understand is that insulin stimulates the ovaries to produce testosterone. And if we’re producing more testosterone, at the expense of other hormones like progesterone, the only way to progesterone is to ovulation, then we’re going to see unwanted symptoms like unwanted hair growth on the chin, chest, abdomen, we’re going to see acne. But as I was talking about with the an ambulatory cycles, without that regular rise and fall of estrogen happening mid cycle, we see that women with PCOS, they may not find themselves thinking about sex, enjoying sex, wanting to engage in sex or even, you know, being receptive to what their partner is putting down, so to speak. And I talk about in the program, some ways to mitigate that. But I think it’s important to understand that there’s so many layers and PCOS, I feel like it’s always like, let’s talk about acne. Let’s talk about weight gain. And yet, there’s so much more because these hormones also impact our mood, which is why women with PCOS, they’re at much higher risk for things like depression and

Dr. Vinu
Yes, true, and it’s no more just periods, right. PCOS is normal just periods. It’s more than that. Your thyroid, your adrenals. And, you know, it affects so many different systems, you know, so? Yep. And so what are some signs that our hormones aren’t normal?

Dr. Brighten
Yeah. Okay, so I’ve gotten into some of it. And I love that you asked this question, because I think that the abnormal has been normalized. So we think like, oh, it’s just normal, that I’m not sleeping at night. And then I’m struggling to fall asleep, when in fact, that could be a sign of hormone imbalance. We’re also seeing issues. So as I was talking about with mood, maybe we’re feeling anxious more before our period. So if we’re not sleeping, and we’re having anxiety before our period, we started to think about a progesterone issue. This is important to pay attention. Because if you are someone with PCOS, who recovers ovulation, which therefore results in menstruation, so you recover a regular cycle, which might look like 35 days to you, it’s a myth, we should all have 20 day cycles. But if you recover this cycle, but you start to notice that, you know, I am feeling like I can’t sleep as well, I’m having anxiety, I’m starting to, you know, cry more easily or be more irritated by my partner. That can be a sign that the progesterone from your ovaries is falling short of where it really needs to be, and can be an early sign that whatever’s happening in your environment, or it and I think, you know, we always come back to like, oh, you know, diet, yes. And it can also be stress related. And so we have to look holistically at the environment, whatever is happening in your environment that’s affecting you in a way that’s causing that progesterone to decline. So that’s just one thing I think that women with PCOS should be tuned into, is that that can be an early sign that we’re going to we’re going to start struggling again. And that isn’t always something that we think about what I think that we often think like once we get the period back, like we’re good, right? Well, life happens. So that’s the progesterone piece. I think women with PCOS, we’ve already discussed some of the excess testosterone that’s really common to see, I wouldn’t call it normal, but it is common, and it is a sign that the ovaries are not doing what they should be. I think some less common symptoms that people think about, I talked about in the book, thyroid disorders as well. So seeing that you you know you’re not going to the bathroom as regularly so you’re filling constipated or you like you have slow motility. If it’s happening just before your period, that could be normal. But if it’s happening constantly, that could be a sign of hypothyroidism. Things like stepping out of bed in the morning and feeling that your feet are already tender. That can be a sign that we don’t have optimal thyroid hormone and it’s we’re not recovering our postural muscles. When the muscles that get a lot of use, those are going to be most sore. And then there’s the common thyroid symptoms people think of like feeling so tired or brain fog or losing your hair, which is what can make PCOS a little bit confusing because your hair loss could be antigen related. Or it could be thyroid related.

Dr. Vinu
Yes. So yeah, it’s like you you need to get tested. St. Louis that’s coming from right. Yeah, you’re down. Yeah. And are there any lifestyle factors that are impactful to bring your hormones back into balance?

Dr. Brighten
This is where it’s just so amazing stuff that keeps you out of the doctor’s office or makes your doctor go, wow, what are you doing? That’s all the stuff that you’re doing at home. So you’re getting tested, super important, getting guidance, you know, on your health and the health journey, really important, but we have to recognize that the majority of what it takes to heal the person is doing at home. So lifestyle factors absolutely play a role. And one of the things I talk about in the book, I actually set up a whole diagram on sleep. So sleep is something that maybe you want to yawn when I bring it up. I know people do at medical conferences, I will present this information. And when I present it in the way that I do, doctors are usually like, oh, my gosh, like the way that my patients sleep habits are affecting their infertility, the way that it’s causing their inflammation to continue, it kind of revives this idea of that we all need good sleep, right, but in a way that’s really tangible. So I have a diagram in the book where I show how poor quality sleep can cause inflammation to go up, insulin dysregulation will increase. So we’ll see increased insulin in a non PCOS person, we can see the development of diabetes increased visceral adiposity. So that is fat that packs around your organs, which is what I care most about is body composition. And where is the fat not just if you have fat because we all have fat, it matters where it’s at and what it’s doing in your body. But in addition to that, not sleeping, and not getting quality sleep can also impact your ovulation. In fact, our ovulation is tied to our circadian rhythms. So this is where exposing yourself to natural light first thing in the morning, when you get into room at night, your bedroom, dark lights as you make it as dark as possible, getting a nice mascot and eyemask make sure that you are keeping the room cool, especially important. If you do get your cycle back and you’re in that week before your period. Progesterone causes your body temperature to rise. And so we’ll need to like and that’s when I said oh but like you might not have enough to stimulate GABA and help your brain sleep. So keeping the room cool. These kinds of route that’s a really simple lifestyle practice light in the morning, dark in the evening. hugely, hugely impactful, not just for ovulation, but also for adrenal health. And if your ovaries are struggling as they can in PCOS to produce hormones at the right time, those adrenal glands are definitely taking a hit. If we’ve got the inflammatory component of PCOS, those adrenal glands are taking a hit. One of the best ways to heal them is to recover them at night. So on top of, we were talking about like the sleep hygiene. This is also where I talk to people about bringing in things like foster title serine, l theanine, passionflower, different aids that help their body get the restorative sleep that allows their hormones to heal.

Dr. Vinu
Right. So it I mean, it seems like a very simple thing, right? All of us, you know, we just say, Oh, I didn’t get a good night’s sleep, you know, and it becomes the normal, but it’s not it should not be the normal. In spite of all life’s challenges. I think we need to establish a sleep routine and kind of stick to it religiously. It sounds like your overall health.

Dr. Brighten
away, just want to say and to your point about the sleep is that we get away with a lot in our 20s and 30s. I think that perimenopause and PCOS, so perimenopause is hard. Okay, hands down, it can be really difficult in this modern world, you on PCOS to that picture and things can be so much more difficult. And one of the things that so many people have let go of is committing to getting quality sleep and committing to keeping this circadian rhythm. And I would challenge any of your listeners do this for five days and see how you feel. Just give it five days. My patients after five days are like I’m never going back to anything else. I feel so different.

Dr. Vinu
Oh, and you kind of brought that up. I was gonna ask a talk to you about that next or next Dr. Brighton. You know, with PCOS, you’re kind of used to not having your cycles regularly. So how do you differentiate from perimenopause and PCOS? But because they kind of mimic the same right? So how exactly would you differentiate between the two?

Dr. Brighten
You know, no one ever asked me this question. And it is something that I brought up in the book, because I think it’s so important. I’m so glad that you asked me this because exactly that so in the book I actually I have a diagram of like, is it functional hypothalamic amenorrhea or is it PCOS? And then I have another section on is a perimenopause so that you can Understand the difference in these. And so it can be really confusing because your cycles are irregular. But now you’re like you’re in your 40s. And you’re like, Well, is it Perry? Or is it just PCOS? Okay, so here’s the thing that we do know, at 45. If you do not have a period for a year, that’s menopause, and that’s considered normal at age 45. perimenopause can start as early as 10 years before then. And perimenopause. The irregular periods is more of a later stage perimenopause, like that when you you pass that midpoint and you’re getting closer to menopause. And once you are not year stretch to menopause, that’s when periods get really irregular. So this is what I would say, if you have PCOS. And you’ve been able to recover some kind of normality to your cycle. And they just want to say that sometimes you’re doing everything right, and you’re having a 48 day cycle, but it is coming every 48 days, like good job, because most of medicine is like you’re never going to be able to have a regular ovulation a regular cycle. But you want to know what your normal is. If you find that now it’s starting to stretch out further and you’re getting 60 plus days. And you’re you’re in that like 35 Plus, I would say with PCOS, really, if you’re in that past 40 range, that is looking more like perimenopause. And right before you hit menopause is when so remember menopause for people listening, that’s a year without a period. Right before you get to that stage. That’s when they’re really going to stretch and the really long and so you’re doing everything the same. Nothing significant has impacted your life. You’re like what gives, it may very well be perimenopause. Now in perimenopause, the first hormone to go is the hormone we already discussed being problematic in PCOS, and that is progesterone. This is why women have anxiety, insomnia, like the hot flashes that come on. That can be because of imbalances of estrogen and progesterone and the way estrogen is playing with your brain. So in PCOS, it can rdv that, like I’ve already struggled with progesterone. So you might feel like your your symptoms are really getting amplified. And while I think that’s bringing on you know, I talk in the book like ways to help your progesterone, so definitely decreasing the stress, getting the good sleep, but bringing on Vitamin C, Vitamin B six, these kinds of things can help your progesterone, but you may need to consider using progesterone replacement therapy or hormone replacement therapy, not progestin in the pill. And why differentiate that is because a lot of doctors will say, Well, you have PCOS, and you’re having Peri menopausal symptoms, let’s just give you the pill. But the problem is, is the pill doesn’t contain progesterone, and progesterone must be metabolized. And then the hormones that come from that metabolism can affect the brain that causes that sense of calm and helps us get sleep. And so what I’m saying here is it’s got to be an oral progesterone that you’re taking. And thankfully, you know, there’s some like, depending on your insurance, I don’t know where people are in the world. But in the United States, sometimes, progesterone hormone replacement therapy from a regular pharmacy is cheaper than getting the pill. So that’s a win.

Dr. Vinu
Good. I mean, I’m glad you differentiated between, you know, not just taking the pill, but actually getting progesterone replacement, right? Because it seemed it looks like there’s a difference between the two. And so you also did touch on, you know, the multivitamins that you would need any other supplements or Dr. Brighton that you would recommend that would help with balancing your hormones.

Dr. Brighten
Yes. So if we’re talking specifically about PCOS, I always recommend getting vitamin D testing, most people are going to do well to do 2000. I use vitamin d3 every day. And that’s not going to prove to be problematic. But the problem could be, you don’t have enough vitamin D as it is. So getting tested will help you understand you need to actually increase those levels. And we know that vitamin D can help with a lot of things in the body. But it absolutely can help with supporting testosterone balance, as can things like nettle and saw palmetto root. So Saw Palmetto is one that people sometimes think like Well, isn’t that for prostate health, I guess. And the reason why it works for PCOS is because it can inhibit an enzyme that converts testosterone to DHT. And DHT is what is behind. That’s the form of testosterone that’s causing us hair loss that’s irreversible on our head. So the miniaturization of the hair follicle that never comes back. So we want to get ahead of that as soon as possible, but also a hair growth on our chin, chest, abdomen, and can be behind the hormonal acne. So on top of the nutrients that I recommended, those are some of the herbs and I’m sure your community is familiar with Myo inositol. I don’t think that anyone I know that has I’ve come across with PCOS who hasn’t asked me or mentioned mio anon so tall. But it was important to understand about Nasr. Tom, is when I’m talking about sleep, this can be another sleep aid. It really can be a two for one. So yes, it can help with PCOS. But it can also help you get restful sleep. If you’re someone who, unfortunately, because these two do like to hang out sometimes, as PCOS and Hashimotos, there’s been research to show that Myo inositol can help with getting your antibodies into remission. So that’s a really, that’s another one I really love. And I would say, an acetyl cysteine. If there isn’t something it doesn’t win in the research. I just haven’t seen it. But NAC it can help with testosterone. But if there’s anybody that’s listening right now, who’s wanting to become pregnant with PCOS, Myo inositol is great for supporting a quality and it may help increase improve a quality and and acetyl cysteine. That is one it’s, it’s an amino acid that helps us make glutathione which is a really important antioxidant. But some research has pointed to it being beneficial in women with with PCOS, in helping prevent miscarriage and helping them have a healthy pregnancy. So it’s definitely worth considering.

 

Dr. Vinu
That’s a great observation. I think I think our listeners gonna appreciate that, you know, that was awesome information. And and you kind of touched on this Dr. Brighton that you know, your sex hormones kind of, you know, you kind of influence your libido. And with PCOS, you know, you we know that it has some impact on libido. So, what can we do? I mean, to, you know, for women to have better sexual health, especially women with PCOS?

Dr. Brighten
Yes. So one of the big things that I talk about, and I get into this in the 20 day program, there’s one ad program, there is all the cyclical soul of the hormone component, and then with your sexual self, so that you can really understand yourself, how many times can I say yourself, but you can understand the full picture of your health. And when it comes to PCOS, we do want to work on optimizing those hormones. So I do have strategies in the book for that. The other component of PCOS that I think it’s often overlooked, is body image concerns and body image concerns. So maybe feeling like you know, you’re you’re not the size you want to be your skin doesn’t look the way you want it to look, you’re, you know, you’ve lost some hair, you have some hair thinning, these different kinds of things that can come up, can really have a negative impact on us in a way that has been recognized in the research. So there’s a model in psychology called the dual control model. And what the researchers came up with is this analogy of gas pedals and brake pedals, basically, excitation inhibition. And when it comes to inhibition, some of us have more sensitive brakes. And those things can can make us feel like we have a low libido, when in reality, it’s more like these things and our nervous system just don’t jive together. And it’s well recognized that concerns around body image can be a break. And that can definitely be something that makes you feel like, why is it that I’m never in the mood? Or why is it I start to get aroused. And then I lose arousal or the ability to orgasm. And there’s a phenomenon known as spectating, which is just like what it sounds like you are basically on the sidelines watching yourself. People do this. I mean, you don’t have to have PCOS. Lots of people do this, when they start getting concerned while they’re having sex about, oh, you know, what is? What does my body look like? Can they see my stretch marks in this position? Like, do I have cellulite right now. And if you’re nodding your head, just know you’re not alone. The research tells us that just about everybody does this in some way. And so understand that you might be thinking you have a low libido. But in reality, it may be that there’s this whole component of self love that we have to work on. And as I talked about in the book, sometimes we have to just focus on pleasure for pleasure sake. And we need to focus on that connection with our partner like the other elements that we enter into sex for. And so I’ve just bring up this component, because it’s something that I’ve talked about in other interviews, but in TCU I feel like in medicine, this entire conversation around how you might feel in your skin kind of gets glazed over especially when we’re talking about libido and especially when people are like that you have testosterone issues, shouldn’t you have a high libido that elevated testosterone does sometimes track with you having a higher libido and having more clitoral sensitivity and having more orgasms, but the psychological component to PCOS and like I said before, being at higher risk for depression anxiety can absolutely impact to your libido. So we want to work on the hormone teas, we certainly want to bring down inflammation. But I would feel remiss if I didn’t speak to the fact that it can be a lot more complex than that. And you deserve to have all of that considered in your health.

Dr. Vinu
And it’s a great point, you make Dr. Brighten it’s not just the direct hormonal influence. It’s also the emotional quotient having PCOS and how you feel about yourself, that comes into the picture. Right? So, yeah, so you kind of, you know, kind of develop all of that and not just focus on what the hormones are directly doing. So yeah, that’s a great point. And so you kind of touched base on your 28 day program. So could you elaborate more I know, you know, 1/3 of your book focuses on the 28 day program for women. And it was a very interesting read for me. So can you tell our listeners a little bit more about the 28 Day Program?

Dr. Brighten
Yes. So you’re going to take that hormone quiz, that questionnaire that I talked about before, and that’s going to help guide you into what is going on with your hormones. If you’re wanting to take the sexual self and adventure on in the 28 days, there’s also a common sexual health questionnaire that I put in the book that’s going to happen in the libido chapter to help you understand that exact sensitivity of the brakes, the gas pedal and the brakes, and how that could be affecting your sexual desire, inhibiting your arousal, and then we’re going to apply it to the cycle. Now I talked to you about what if you don’t have a cycle in the book. So if you’re not currently cycling, you’re still going to employ these things. And I encourage people just follow the moon cycle, so that the New Moon is the period and the full moon is when you would expect to ovulate. And why I say just follow the moon cycle is because it’s in the sky, you see it every night. Maybe you don’t. But you can Google it, it’s pretty easy. So it’s a really easy framework to just get started with. But if you are cycling regularly, I talk about, you know how you can apply this. Now it’s a 28 day framework. And as I said, most people are not having cycles that are 20 days. But we always teach from this perspective, because it’s just like why we teach from the period being the start of the menstrual cycle, even though technically ovulation is the start of the menstrual cycle. But it’s a good way to understand and really grasp the information. But you can take this and you can apply it to your own cycle first takes understanding your cycle altogether. And like when am I in my follicular phase? Did I ovulate? What’s happening at these different times. So I take you through four weeks, 28 days, and in that you’ll be doing exercises to help you with your lifestyle, incorporate supplementations if you supplements if you want to go that route, how to be eating in a way that’s really nourishing to your hormones. I focus a lot on what do we bring in? How do we nourish our hormones, and less on what do we need to take out I think the PCOS community has heard, I mean, so much information about like, take this up, take that out. And you know, as a doctor who’s also nutrition scientists, there is there is good reason to take some things out. But I really think psychologically speaking, we all do better when we feel like we’re getting more and we’re getting we’re getting to bring stuff in. And so that’s really my approach. Now, in the book, the book is really big, as you know, fortunately, it is not a read from front to back. And why I say fortunately, is because we don’t all have time to just read an entire book. So you can get in get your questions answered. Some people that I’ve talked to, they’re like, I just started with the program, I just got that going. And then I worked my way backwards. So because the book is such a good size, we weren’t able to fit all the meal plans and recipes in there that I wanted. So instead, I wrote a digital cookbook that goes along with the book. So when you get into the program on page 302, there’s a URL there, you plug that in, and you can get a digital cookbook that has over 50 recipes. And it takes you week by week. And the reason why I did that no publishers were like, look, we want it we want more information, all of these health books, they all put recipes in, and we’ll just make a cookbook in the future. And for me, I’m like, listen, people do a lot better with framework. And I would rather provide people all the tools they need for success. So I was like, I’m just gonna rent that cookbook. Now to get two for one, you get two books in one. And so if you do want to go that route, you can grab those meal plans, and then they apply again to that 28 Day framework. And in those recipes, I teach you what about those recipes is helping your hormones. What about that recipe is going to help your thyroid? What about that recipe is going to help you you know, get your progesterone levels up. And then that way as you’re going through the program, you’re not only eating in a way that’s going to nourish your hormones and support them, but you’re learning how to incorporate those foods so that in the future and as you transition away from the program, you feel calm Putting in your own kitchen at the grocery store to be able to take charge of your hormones through the foods that you’re eating.

Dr. Vinu
Yeah, I did not check out the URL but I am I would be really interested in those recipes. And to all our listeners, Dr. brighten book Is This normal, it was completely awesome. And like she said, you know, the first she has three sections and I actually started with the second section myself and progress to the third. So it is available online and in all bookstores, and Dr. Brighten for our listeners if they wanted to find more information about your book and you Where could they go look for that information? Yeah, so

Dr. Brighten
my main hub is Dr. brighton.com, DrBrighten.com. And then you can find me all over social media at Dr. Jolene Brighton. And I have a ton of ease in my name but it’s Jolene Brighten.

Dr. Vinu
Yes. And any last your take home messages for our listeners, Dr. Brighten,

Dr. Brighten
you know talking to an audience of PCOS women, I really want you to understand that just because you have this diagnosis doesn’t mean you are this diagnosis. I think it’s really easy for practitioners to label you and then treat you as nothing but a label. But you have the capacity to heal and you are so much more than just a set of four letters.

Dr. Vinu
Awesome. Thank you Dr. Brighton. This, it was really great meeting with you. And I wish you the best of luck for your book.

Dr. Brighten
Oh, thank you so much. I appreciate your time today. This was a lovely conversation.

Dr. Vinu
Thank you. Bye bye